What do we call persons who don’t recognize their own suffering?

What do we call someone who does not recognize that they are suffering? What do you call someone who does not recognize the root cause of their suffering? What do you call someone who refuses to accept the cause of their suffering? We call them innocent, just like children, just like animals. And then we see them as spirit souls, and we try to serve them on their spiritual journey. Hare Krishna!

Have you ever seen an animal that is about to be slaughtered? In the modern world, that includes most chickens, goats, sheep, pigs, cows, fish, and buffaloes.

Sheep, to the slaughter

These sheep are being led to slaughter

Animals cannot see their impending doom

I have spent much time in the South Indian City of Hyderabad. This city has a large Muslim population. The Muslims celebrate a festival called Bakri-eid, when many Muslims sacrifice a goat to Allah. It is a common sight to see a Muslim man leading a goat somewhere just before Eid, or even on the day of.

Charminar, Old City, Hyderabad, India

As a child, I was tempted to innocently call out to the goat “run away goat, run away, you are about to be slaughtered”. But no, neither do I have the power to make a goat understand that his life is in danger, nor does the goat have the intelligence to understand his fate.

Even right before being slaughtered, the animal can be seen calmly gobbling up grass here and there, oblivious.

Goat chewing and chewing, oblivious

We can extrapolate… think about the animals being transferred in trains or trucks from one place to another. They are all going to be slaughtered, sooner or later.

Cows being transported for slaughter

What about us? Can we see our own sufferings?

As we go about the world, we see so many suffering souls. Some are hungry, some others are unclothed, hot, or cold… yet others are diseased. And everyone is striving, struggling, to solve these problems of life, food, shelter, and clothing, medical treatment, and so on.

Struggling human, sisyphean effort

It is of course, natural for a human being or an animal to mitigate an immediate danger. For example, once an animal senses that someone is causing it harm, for example the pain of a hook in it’s mouth, or a botched attempt at slaughter, it will flap about, bleat, moo, or make some other frantic sounds, maybe try to fight it’s attacker, and even try to run away, but alas, by then it is usually too late.

Goat, about to lose it's life

Similarly, we see human beings trying to mitigate their sufferings in so many ways.

But do they really recognize the actual cause of their suffering?

Man getting medical treatment

Does that woman who is being wooed ardently by that handsome, passionate, suave, smooth-talking man realize that once the man has had his fill of sensual gratification, she will be left behind after an “it’s not you, it’s me conversation.”?

Young man wooing a girl with sweet words and flowers

Does that hard-working employee staying late and working long hours realize that a business change means he is to be on the next list of employees to be laid off due to a “Reduction in Force” or “Headcount cut” or “Re-organization”?

Hardworking employee, doesn't know he is just one step away from being fired

Does that person suffering poverty, pestilence, or war realize that they have created their own situation with their own past actions?

तत्तेऽनुकम्पां सुसमीक्षमाणो
भुञ्जान एवात्मकृतं विपाकम् ।
हृद्वाग्वपुर्भिर्विदधन्नमस्ते
जीवेत यो मुक्तिपदे स दायभाक् ॥ ८ ॥

tat te ’nukampāṁ su-samīkṣamāṇo
bhuñjāna evātma-kṛtaṁ vipākam
hṛd-vāg-vapurbhir vidadhan namas te
jīveta yo mukti-pade sa dāya-bhāk

My dear Lord, one who earnestly waits for You to bestow Your causeless mercy upon him, all the while patiently suffering the reactions of his past misdeeds and offering You respectful obeisances with his heart, words and body, is surely eligible for liberation, for it has become his rightful claim.

https://vedabase.io/en/library/sb/10/14/8

Suffering Child. Who creates our suffering for us?

How can we help everyone understand how to end this cycle of suffering?

Sometimes, not being satisfied with trying to please the senses, an intellectual may, instead, choose to live within the mind, for example in the realm of art, literature, poetry, scientific or mathematical endeavours, maybe even philosophy and speculation about God?

Intellectuals, lost in the world of trying to satisfy the mind

Does the frustrated intellectual, who has given up on gross materialistic gratification and is now involved in trying to satisfy the mind realize that he’s only headed towards insanity?

Mad Scientists. What will they not do?

Neither the mind, nor the senses can ever be satisfied, as much as a fire can never be extinguished by giving it more fuel.

lust cannot be satisfied by any amount of sense enjoyment, just as fire is never extinguished by a constant supply of fuel. In the material world, the center of all activities is sex, and thus this material world is called maithunya-āgāra, or the shackles of sex life. In the ordinary prison house, criminals are kept within bars; similarly, the criminals who are disobedient to the laws of the Lord are shackled by sex life.

https://vedabase.io/en/library/bg/3/39, purport

Blazing fire, no amount of fuel will extinguish it!

We try and we try and we try to help everyone understand that they are not their mind, that they are not this body, not the senses… we try and try to help them understand that actually they are the spirit soul.

Hare Krishna Monk tries to distribute spiritual literature

But unfortunately, most of the souls we come in contact with are not interested. They are content to pursue that next gourmet meal, that next sensual experience, that holiday, that next acquisition, be it a house or a car or some other shiny object. They are content to chase job after job, climbing the ladder to nowhere (more on that another time).

What do we call such a soul, even if in a human body?

Are we cultivating the consciousness of animals. Then what is our destination?

We call such a person an animal in human form. You may be shocked at this. How dare I call a human being an animal? How arrogant and conceited of me! What sort of spiritualist am I, this Das?

यस्यात्मबुद्धि: कुणपे त्रिधातुके
स्वधी: कलत्रादिषु भौम इज्यधी: ।
यत्तीर्थबुद्धि: सलिले न कर्हिचि-
ज्जनेष्वभिज्ञेषु स एव गोखर: ॥ १३ ॥
yasyātma-buddhiḥ kuṇape tri-dhātuke
sva-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu bhauma ijya-dhīḥ
yat-tīrtha-buddhiḥ salile na karhicij
janeṣv abhijñeṣu sa eva go-kharaḥ

One who identifies his self as the inert body composed of mucus, bile and air, who assumes his wife and family are permanently his own, who thinks an earthen image or the land of his birth is worshipable, or who sees a place of pilgrimage as merely the water there, but who never identifies himself with, feels kinship with, worships or even visits those who are wise in spiritual truth — such a person is no better than a cow or an ass.

https://vedabase.io/en/library/sb/10/84/13

My dear reader, please understand that a spiritualist is just like an honest doctor. An honest doctor is not afraid to observe carefully and make the right diagnosis. From the doctor’s diagnosis comes a treatment plan, including diet, rest, exercise, and medicine. And from this comes a prognosis, some hope of hope, possibly.

But a doctor who sweeps the symptoms under a rug and pretends everything is just fine, is no doctor. Such a “doctor” is really an enemy in disguise.

A doctor must be honest!

And therefore, out of abundant compassion, we call such a human an animal. So that we may develop even more patience and compassion. After all, there is no point being too harsh with an animal or a child. We then try to coax and cajole and convince in this way or in that way.

Physician Heal Thyself

First things first. As a spiritualist, I seek to spot the times when I myself behave as if I were my mind or my body. And I strive to disassociate myself, my self interest from the urges of the body or the mind. If I can be honest with myself, then I will have a deep sense of humility and understanding as to why this is so difficult for me. My conditioning in the material world makes it extremely difficult, and I have been trying for decades!

So, what should I do? First and foremost, look in the mirror and be honest with myself at all times, places, and circumstances.

I cannot be like this kitten here!

Compassion and Equal Vision!

Just as we need to see ourselves and where we are, we need to see everyone with an equal vision, and understand that every spirit soul is precious!

Not all souls can be served in the same way… I cannot discuss philosophy with a dog, nor can I get a pig to appreciate delicious food.

विद्याविनयसम्पन्ने ब्राह्मणे गवि हस्तिनि ।
श‍ुनि चैव श्वपाके च पण्डिता: समदर्शिन: ॥ १८ ॥

vidyā-vinaya-sampanne
brāhmaṇe gavi hastini
śuni caiva śva-pāke ca
paṇḍitāḥ sama-darśinaḥ

The humble sages, by virtue of true knowledge, see with equal vision a learned and gentle brāhmaṇa, a cow, an elephant, a dog and a dog-eater [outcaste].

https://vedabase.io/en/library/bg/5/18

For 99% of the population, we just try to engage in the chanting of God’s names. We give them Krishna Prasada, sanctified food, which has been lovingly cooked for and offered to Krishna. We then drip in a little bit of the medicine of the philosophy, you are not this body, you are not this mind, you are a spirit soul.

Hare Krishnas out on Harinam Sankirtan, out to save us all!

And so the effort continues, many, many spiritual warriors trying to save one soul, lifetime after lifetime, in a concerted harmonious effort.

The merciful Srila Prabhupada distributes Krishna Prasada generously to one and all.

My dear soul, please help us with this greatest of all causes, please do your bit for yourself, and then turn to serve others and help them get on and stay on a spiritual journey. Hare Krishna!

Why not eat flesh, if vegetables have life too?

If vegetables have life and vegetarians eat them, then what’s the harm in eating flesh of birds and animals?

Rathin, 28/04/2015

Hare Krishna,

Please accept my humble obeisances,

All glories to Srila Gurudeva and Srimati Gurumataji,

All glories to Srila Prabhupada.

I will humbly request all of you to enlighten me on this subject.

When I talk to my friends about non-veg. The very common excuse is that vegetables also have life.

Telling them about the consciousness of the body and offering food to Sri Krishna, is something beyond their comprehension.

I will like to ask you all, what else can be said in layman terms to help them understand their ignorance.

your servant

Rathin

Delicious Meal of Krishna Prasad – Pure Vegetarian Food Cooked With Love and Offered to Krishna

Sridhar Das, 28/04/2015

Hare Krishna!

Please accept my humble obeisances!

All Glories to Srila Gurudeva and Srimati Gurumataji!

All Glories to His Divine Grace Srila Prabhupada!

If we read Srila Prabhupada books, especially The Hare Krishna challenge book, it clearly explains there. Jivo jivasya jivananam. In other words, the material nature is so designed that one living entity is food for the other. So therefore kill we have to. Howsoever, an intelligent human will prefer to commit necessary violence or take whatever is necessary from nature as goes the saying – one must consume as per one’s need rather than one’s greed.

The Hare Krishna Challenge

In fact animals are already doing that. So human has to commit violence. But if one can, more than maintain one’s life from such a variety of vegetarianism then why kill animals? We agree violence has to be done, but why commit unnecessary violence?

I find it important to make them realize through an example. Everyone can use their own and I generally say – if a thief hijacks your family one night and points the gun on your head and demands – your phone, money, jewellery, all valuables now or I shoot one or more of your family members, choose one!

There can be many versions. Some friend preached a family of 5 with a dog, the option being, one has to be shot down, choose one.

Now of course an intelligent person won’t let his/her parents off. He/She will prefer that which is less violent and more tolerable to the mind relatively.

Similarly, one should intelligently choose to kill plants (still unintelligent because this is also sinful and thievery, if consumed without thanking Krishna through the offering process).

Actually, if one performs proper farming then there is no killing incurred. The grains, fruits, etc. if pluck on the right time after a specific time period, there is no killing incurred and the quality is best too! Besides that, you take one and very easily we get another fruits from same tree. But if they take an animal, where do they get another so easily? Can they grow animals so easily like fruits? Why do they want to deprive animals of life? Why do they consider them devoid of emotions?  A cow or any other bird feels same anxiety as a human does when their children are lost. If it’s all the same then why don’t they offer their own children for slaughter?

Sometimes they will say – we eat meat to become like a strong bull.  But then where did the bull get all its nutrients from? Grass!!

Another point, if we study the nature and body of herbivores and carnivores ( intestine length, acid strength, teeth architecture, claws/nails, etc as given in Hare Krishna cookbook) it’s evident what we are meant to consume.

Moreover I was reading Back to Godhead magazine’s Jan/Feb issue where an aspiring devotee said that his wife forced their child to take meat for proper protein value, is that true? The answer was such people neglect the fact that along with protein, excess cholesterol and animal fat are also ingested into the human system resulting in fatal diseases as per many doctors. Also, to keep up the meat business, many industries drug the poor animals for better meat quality (I have watched many documentaries like “From farm to fridge”. Just imagine what effect this will have on consumers? Greenhouse is another result. Point is that nature provides sufficient milk, lentils, grains, nuts, fruits, vegetables and what not for a healthy human diet (includes proteins). Excess protein rather leads to severe body damage and damage to it’s immunity system.

Back to Godhead Magazine. Do you have a subscription?

If they love God or nature, if they respect all, they will respect God’s other equal children too than depriving them of rights to live on the same land just because they can’t speak human language or just because they can manage their living without working hard in coats and suits. 

If they continue to keep slaughtering like this sinfully then as per nature’s law nature will also continue to slaughter them as Srila Prabhupada concludes through world wars/crimes going on day after day.

Slaughtered Slaughterer, or karmic reactions from killing

So, there are many such points that can be spoken strongly with faith and confidence, to the extent we are convinced about the disgusting nature of animal slaughtering and also to the extent we take shelter of Prabhupada’s teachings faithfully.

But if they can often be fed with sumptuous Krishna Prasadam, then that alone will act as the best counter, trust me!

your servant

Sridhar Das

Nashvin, 28/04/2015

Hare Krsna Rathin Prabhu!

If they do not see the spiritual perspective of offering food etc, you can propose something to them:

Living entities all survive by consuming the bodies of other living entities (either animals or plants).  So, would they like to kill other animals themselves and eat them, or harvest some crops instead?  There is a reason that families go pick strawberries together, but do not have excursions to the slaughterhouse…

your servant,

Nashvin

Premananda Das, 28/04/2015

Hare Krishna

In layman terms it is fact that “One man’s meat is another man’s poison.”When it rains the umbrella shopkeeper is happy that it keeps raining as more  more umbrellas  sells and he makes profit but the people who buy wish it does not rain.This is law of nature each person is dependent on someone one whether he likes it or not.

One Man’s Food, Another Man’s Poison

Similarly Krishna says in BG 9.26 :

patram puspam phalam toyam

yo me bhaktya prayaccati

tad aham bhakty-upahrtam

asnami prayatatmanah

If one offers Me with love and devotion a leaf,a flower,fruit or water,I will accept it.

It is clearly mentioned in this verse that without offering to Him every mouthful of food will keep the person entangled in birth and death. Krishna mentions leaf,fruit,flowers and water this He will accept.He does not mention meat ,fish and eggs.

Another point is when you have not created anything that means you are not the Supreme controller or owner.As Krishna is the Supreme proprietor we must agree to what He says in Bhagavad Gita as it is without interpretations.

In BG 3.13

yajna-sistasinah santo

mucyante sarva-kilbisaih

bhunjate te tv agham papa

ye pacanty atma-karanat

The devotees of the Lord are released from all kinds of sins because they eat food which is offered first for sacrifice,others who prepare food for sense enjoyment verily eat sin.

The most important point in this verse is that these performances keep them aloof from all kinds of contamination of sinful association in material world.

Therefore in order for people to be happy they must be taught to perform the easy process of sankirtana-yajna,in full Krishna consciousness.Otherwise there can be no peace and happiness in the world.

You try your best to explain to him the method of real happiness and if he accepts it is the best welfare activity.

your servant,

Premananda Das

Manian VB, 28/04/2015

Hare Krishna prabhu: 

Vegetable food also is a living being, but when offered to Krishna, the sin of eating it is removed and it gets purified. This is what our Guruji has said. Chant Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare

Manian VB

Nishima, 28/04/2015

Hare Krishna

Sripad Sankarshan Das Adhikari

The same question was being asked by me to HH Sankarshan Maharaj ji and He gave me the following answer:

My Dear Nishima, 

Please accept my blessings.

All glories to Srila Prabhupada.

I am absolutely delighted to learn that our daily Krishna conscious broadcast, “Thought for the Day”, is enabling you to have Krishna conscious day every day. This is dream come true for me that I can be helping others in this way. It is surely the mercy of Lord Sri Krishna.

Regarding your question, Krishna orders us in the Bhagavad-gita that we can only take foods which have been first offered to Him. Since Krishna is a vegetarian, He will not accept any offering of meat. Therefore as the eaters of only Krishna prasadam we have no choice but to be vegetarians also. So actually we are not vegetarians; we are Krishnatarians, those who eat only the remnants of what has been offered first to Krishna.

I hope this meets you in the best of health

and in an ecstatic mood.

Your ever well-wisher, 

Sankarshan Das Adhikari

Nishima

Mahabhagavat Das, 28/04/2015

Dear Sriman Rathin Mandal,

Please accept my humble obeisances.

All glories to Srila Gurudeva.

All glories to Srila Prabhupada.

Your question is nice because I know that you are not unaware of the various reasons why meat is not recommended food. I also read with interest all the answers and was happy to read them, thank you to all who responded to Rathin’s request.

I was thinking you were asking “what might appeal to a person who is arguing only for the sake of arguing” or “what might convince a person who does not care about another living entity’s suffering”.

What’s in it For Me? This is what materialists care about.

My personal experience is that speaking  to a materialist, pointing out what is in it for them has the greatest effect. Everyone is interested in “What’s in it for me” – “WIIFM”. So you can focus on health, how the educated and wealthy elite worldwide are switching to a vegetarian diet while the poor and uneducated are eating meat, how eating meat causes so many diseases like heart disease, hypertension, cancer etc., and so on, you can talk about the toxins released in the body as a response to fear of death, how those toxins cannot be removed from meat, etc.

All the arguments are there in the book “Higher Taste”, just familiarize yourself, and see which one works best with which person.

The Higher Taste. Get a Copy!

Above all the arguing etc. though, the best thing would be to give them the actual taste of Krishna Prasada, this works wonders, Srila Prabhupada starting the Hare Krishna movement by his Kirtan, classes, and his lovingly cooked Sunday feasts. The person who cooks your food influences your consciousness greatly, so why not take an indirect approach to increasing the spiritual intelligence of the poor meat eaters by giving them Krishna Prasada without necessarily telling them all about it?

Many advanced devotees have done this, and I was also a recipient of such mercy myself.

Sincerely,

Mahabhagavat Das

Bhakta Sunil, 28/04/2015

Hare Krishna

My respects to all readers

Regarding this topic , i had a debate with a social media contact and to convince him about importance of vegetarian food , i researched and gave him the following reply after which he did not debate further and was friendly too

——–

Dear , it is very nice that there is a tendency to not give pain to animals. But kindly note that denying the right to live defies mercy , irrespective of giving pain or not. For example , the punishment to a criminal for homicide is same irrespective of whether the homicide involves pain or not.

That one can eat plants does not imply that one can eat animals. Yes plants are also living entities.

Kindly note that meat is food in mode of ignorance.

Meat is also not easy on the GIT , as is known to medical science. Medical science provides documentation that Humans are biologically Herbivores. As pointed in the bottom line of the following article link by Physician (wonders never cease!) named Milton R. Mills : “Here’s another piece of information to digest: plant foods leave the body in 2 – 4 days; flesh foods leave the body in 5 – 7 days. If a clump of rotting flesh sits in your body for a minimum of 5 days, where do all the poisons, chemicals, and excessive hormones that flood the animal’s body at the time of death go? And we wonder why we suffer from degenerative diseases!”

Refer to http://blogs.naturalnews.com/humans-are-biologically…/

“Clean India Campaign” can be linked linked to meat eating because cleanliness is not only physical but also internally of habits , of which meat eating habit is predominant

Meat eating in long run develops animalistic propensities of terrorism , violence , cruelty to fellow beings. No Meat= No killing = No mentality of violence = No terrorism/No violence

Refer to this article : http://www.veggieboards.com/…/121433-meat-eating-leads…

Vegetables , fruits , grains , milk are foods in mode of goodness and make one feel energetic and fresh

Yes eating vegetables is violence, and vegetarians are also committing violence against other living entities because vegetables also have life. But here, significantly, it is stated that every living entity has to live by killing another entity; that is the law of nature. One living entity is the life for another living entity. But for a human being, that violence should be committed only as much as necessary. Extra violence is against the law of nature.

If we will have mercy on the animals, mercy will be given to us. What goes around comes around. We should be merciful to the animals by not slaughtering them and giving them all protection. We should allow them to live peacefully and happily. The more we give mercy to others, the mercy will be given to us.

———

in a humble mood,

Bhakta Sunil

Sulakshana devi dasi, 28/04/2015

Hare Krishna,

Please accept my humble obeisances,

All glories to Srila Gurudeva and Srimati Gurumataji,

All glories to Srila Prabhupada

Yes, vegetables also have life. Therefore Vaishnavas offer their eatables to Krishna before they partake it. By offering the food to Krishna the food is sanctified and we are free from all the sin.

Krishna Lifts Govardhan
Krishna, The Supreme Personality of Godhead, lifts Govardhan Hill

The fruits and the grains when they are taken from the tree or a plant do not kill the tree. Typically when the grains are harvested the plant is usually dried up so in other words there is no killing of the plant or tree there. Of course every living entity subsists by killing another living entity. The consciousness in the plant life is very dormant compared to other higher moving living entities. Consuming animal flesh for one’s sustenance is much more sinful than consuming vegetarian meal. Also Lord Krishna says in BG that He will accept a flower or a leaf or fruit or water if one offers Him with love but He does not say that He will accept animal products.

your humble servant,

Sulakshana devi dasi

Nashvin, 30/04/2015

Hare Krsna!

Another thing you can query is:

If eating animals is equivalent to eating plants, why not eat humans as well then? 🙂

your servant,

Nashvin

Rathin Mandal, 03/05/2015

Hare Krishna,

Please accept my humble obeisances,

All glories to Srila Gurudeva and Srimati Gurumataji,

All glories to Srila Prabhupada.

Thank you everybody for giving me so many wonderful answers.

This enlightened me to a great extent

your servant

Rathin

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